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  1. #1
    Team NZH: Order of Merit 2HEKTK's Avatar
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    CL1 Accord Euro R vs CL7 Accord Euro R

    Hello,

    Has anybody done any back to back tests with the CL1 and CL7. Ive owned a CL1 but haven't driven a CL7. I know the stats for each power output, H22A vs K20A etc

    What im after is opinoins from people who have driven both, handling characteristics, power delivery, stopping power for standard/near standard models.

    Cheer's,

    Mark
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  2. #2
    Support Team: Forum Admin Matty's Avatar
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    I'm also very interested, so although I don't have anything worthwhile to add to the topic (other than K20 pwnz H22 and 6-speed > 5-speed) I'll post a needlessly long-winded message in order to subscribe to the thread, instead of simply clicking the "watch this topic" link.

    [edit] Oh, and made you look. [/edit]
    Bloody Volvo driver.

  3. #3
    Team NZH: Order of Merit 2HEKTK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Matty

    [edit] Oh, and made you look. [/edit]
    Damn you I thought you had something insightful to add, get back to feeding the baby or changing nappies :!:
    No roll cage, No harness, No run-offs, No brakes - www.nzoffshore.co.nz
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  4. #4
    8,000rpm (B Series Redline!) TakeiTeg's Avatar
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    I've driven both,as well as jdm DC5R and others.

    well back then when my h22ar was in I did some "testing" with Uncle Frank's missus's CL7R which I think had a intake? or bone stock?

    Anyways at the time I had 3 people in my car (i wasn't driving sadly) I had 17" wheels, full sounds(2 subs/amps at the back) and All i can say is wow,
    I thought I had the edge but after 100km/h when my car was shifted to 3rd gear, the CL7 pwned me, it basically pulled off and I had at least a i/h/e done! but 0-100 was similar..but this is a bone stock CL7!

    So the 6 speed and the smoootthhhness of the K20 definitely out performed my piece of whale, and I wreckon after I did the weight saving downgrading to 16" regas etc I would have probably either only just kept up or somewhere round there or If I'm lucky I probably might only be able to just pass it.

    But eitherway I love the new K20's and my experience from the K20 CL7 was it's smoothness, yes it's a 2L but torque/power delivery is way better then the h22 imo, it was so much easier to drive and power is there when you need it, no need to rev up high like the b/h series.

    In terms of handling, well stock for stock CL7 all the way, brakes? well stock for stock CL7 was a bit better, maybe more firm, thou the DC5 brembo are FTW.

    either way, overall CL7 > CL1 new techonlogy good.

    The CL7 is just smoother, easier to drive, and more comfortable, and well way faster stock, a stock CL1 really just suxass imo compared to the new K series high performance hondas.

    You really need to do proper mods and try to get it as light as possibly can to make it go well.

  5. #5
    Support Team: Forum Admin Matty's Avatar
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    ...Annnnd just to semi-threadjack, anyone compared them both to the K24-powered CL9 Euro?
    Bloody Volvo driver.

  6. #6
    Team NZH: Order of Merit 2HEKTK's Avatar
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    Thats what I was after Eric :thumbsup:

    Whats the going rate landed for CL7's at the moment?
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  7. #7
    8,000rpm (B Series Redline!) TakeiTeg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 2HEKTK
    Thats what I was after Eric :thumbsup:

    Whats the going rate landed for CL7's at the moment?
    and oh I've driven around 4-5 stock CL1's as well, lol

    CL7's are around I would say late 20's to early-mid 30G's now I think?
    Haven't imported in a while, but rules have changed A LOT now, very very strict from the ltsa but in terms of pricing they are similar.

    1-2 years ago ti was going around mid 30G's me thinks for low k's so should be a bit cheaper now.

    Matty, I never "tested" against a CL9 K24 Euro with CL1R or CL7, but I have test driven a normal 6 speed CL9 and Auto and also the mugen Accord euro manual(nz new)
    brake wise it's about the same imo, maybe the CL7 was a bit better (better pads?) Handling wise CL7 was much better, harder, firmer the CL9 was softer but comfortable but the 6 speed is SMOOOOTHHH well so is the CL7 but this one was luxury smooth like power was there torque was there and it was just so balanced.
    Thou there is a huge difference between a brand new one and one that has done 15000k's they become much mroe powerful and responsive.

    In terms of speed and power CL7 of course will win, but the CL9 would be one I would drive because it's luxury but has that sport side of it and I like leather softy seats..heh sick of them recaros.
    They are 2 pretty diff cars but they are both so very easily drivable, the mugen Accord euro looks super nice and sounds nice power was good for a 2.4L and of coruse revs right up and power was always there, but it just looked sexy imo and I'd probably prefer the CL9 for daily, perfect for long distance etc.

    but that's just my opinion..don't you guys need to work or something?
    heh...2 more min till I finish work. 8)

    oops *Edit* in other words the CL9 was softer more comfortable and CL7 was well a little bit the opposite,
    Also, CL1 recaro sits WAYYY TOO HIGHHH...

  8. #8
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    Just wondering, has anyone compared the CL1 with the CF4? Same year different engines, and is the k20a in the cl7's comparable to the k20b's?

  9. #9
    Support Team: Forum Admin Matty's Avatar
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    Never heard of a K20B.
    Bloody Volvo driver.

  10. #10
    Team NZH: Order of Merit 2HEKTK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Goose
    Just wondering, has anyone compared the CL1 with the CF4? Same year different engines, and is the k20a in the cl7's comparable to the k20b's?
    The CL1 is a far superior car than the CF4 in every way, engine, handling, interior etc Id only buy a CF4 if I was after a cheap cruise car they seem very slow.

    K20A is in the CL7's. Never heard of the K20B before, don't think it exists
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  11. #11
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    crud, i was think of the f20, in which case i doubt there are any similarities ops:

  12. #12
    8,000rpm (B Series Redline!) TakeiTeg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Goose
    crud, i was think of the f20, in which case i doubt there are any similarities ops:
    F20B is what u are refering to in the CF4's there is the 180hp F20B(1) in the auto SiR and the 200hp SiR-T F20B(2), F20B is basically a de-stroked H22a engine but re-tuned/balanced, it was made back in the days because they needed a 2L engine in the jdm 2L touring car series which used a de-stroked H22 that was 2L so therefore they had to bring some out to production in which was used on the SiR-SiR-T called as the F20B which had better highend then the normal h22s.

  13. #13
    4,000rpm (Taxi Drag)
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    shall we do a test sometime ?
    11500rpm H22A Redline
    14.8 @ 152k half naked interior + road tyre

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  14. #14
    5,000rpm (VTEC Power!) K_ma23's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EURO R
    shall we do a test sometime ?
    yeah, i will do it with my 18" too

    The thing i love about cl7 is that its got a 6 speed box but they just look the same to every other accord euros(cl9) on the street.

    Cant really compare the K20 and the H22, the poor h22 was designed 16 years ago.

    new technology owns.
    Hondata s300 powered Accord Euro R at 8200rpm
    Its not how many horse power you have, its how powerful your horses are.

  15. #15
    Team NZH: Order of Merit mick's Avatar
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    mick is a sad panda
    *goes to price up CL9's*

    http://www.trademe.co.nz/Trade-Me-Mo...n-80355406.htm
    Man that is one sexy beast
    Subby.

  16. #16
    7,000rpm (Peak Power) PRF's Avatar
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    Accord: CL1 v CL9 v CL7

    I've driven all three CL Accord's: CL1, CL7, CL9.
    Including both pre facelift, and facelift CL9.
    5AT and 6MT versions.
    And TakeiTeg summed it up nicely.

    I was sceptical when I first read the specification of the CL7.
    I just didn't think it would work out better than the CL1 which has more torque, but 5MT.
    But driving the CL7 allayed my concerns.
    Highlighting its better chassis, refinement (which can result in feeling less involving but here it doesn't apply).
    And 6MT make up for the lack of quoted torque compared to the CL1.
    Its ratios are so well chosen for its weight that I didn't feel the CL7 was lacking torque at all.
    It is a very impressive package.
    Well built, solid yet nimble.
    And has many touches throughout highlighting how well a job Honda has done in designing the CL7.
    Backed up by just how good the CL9 is even.
    IMHO its Honda's best Accord yet by far, and one of their best models of this decade.

    My only complaint with the CL7 is its 6MT travel from gear to gear is much longer than the same package in EP3 and DC5.
    Continuing the Honda tradition of the Accord gets the longer travel MT over the same grade Civic/Integra.
    To the point even Mugen offer a Short Shift package for CL7.
    My other complaint is that the Arm Rest between the front seats is too high, and gets in the way when changing gear.
    Seat height and light steering are other complaints, but that's nit picking on what's otherwise an excellent car. :thumbsup:

    The CL9 Euro's sold locally are fine machines.
    And its good to see it sell strongly locally.
    The facelift is suprisingly firm riding on its factory 225/45R17 Bridgestone Potenza RE040.
    And that's a compliment. :thumbsup:
    Its K24A is strong, though lacks the extended headroom of the K20A Euro R model.
    Just don't expect it to rev and handle like a CL7, and you won't be disappointed.
    Its still surpringly agile, and up for spirited driving.
    Even the 5AT has to be Honda's finest Auto Transmission yet.
    Huge improvement on Honda's previous 4AT's, providing smooth, notch free changes on and off the throttle.
    Even on cold starts when parked on an incline.
    Though we'll need to see how the 5AT's behave after being on the market for over a decade.

    My only complaints with the CL9 is the seating position.
    Again like CL7, still too high.
    And I'm only 5'8.
    Steering is still too light and needs more weight to match the excellent handling.
    Mind you, its light years better than the EPS models.
    Same Arm Rest issue as the CL7.
    DBW throttle takes getting used to, and I've still yet to find a way to drive them smoothly on a light, trailing throttle application.
    Though, that would apply to all DBW throttles I've driven so far, regardless of marque.

    As for CF4 and how it compares.
    I've only driven the 4AT CF4 SiR.
    Having owned a CD6 previously.
    While you can see and feel the improvement the CF4 is over the CD6.
    I find the CF4 is not in the same league as the CL1.
    Let alone the CL7/9, which are a major leap forward again.
    And on an altogether different level.

    Quote Originally Posted by K_ma23
    yeah, i will do it with my 18" too
    The thing i love about cl7 is that its got a 6 speed box but they just look the same to every other accord euros(cl9) on the street.
    new technology owns.
    One of the best way to null the performance of this fine machine, is to fit larger diameter wheels that are heavier than the stock 17's.
    Along with tyres that are taller in Overall Diameter than stock 215/45R17.

    Don't make the mistake of fitting CL9 size 225/45R17 Potenza RE040's either.
    As replacement's for the CL7's 215/45R17 Potenza RE050, come the time your CL7 is due for new tyres.
    The increase on Overall Diameter will dull the package that is the exclelent CL7 Euro R.




    Like previous generations of BMW M5.
    I like the fact the CL7 has only a few subtle hints that it is the performance machine it is over the rest of the CL9 range.
    For me its different grille, badges, and Recaro's (thankfully not available in loud as red).
    Are more than enough to differentiate it from other CL9 models.
    Even from the JDM CL9 Accord pre facelift 24S grade, now facelift Type S grade.
    Which has the same bodykit, foglights, and wheels as CL7.

    Definitely the CL7~9 Accord is a great example of Honda's new technology delivering.
    Even the European press rate the CL9 highly.
    Its a real pity they never received the CL7.
    Lucky for us all here in NZ. :thumbsup:
    High revvingly yours,
    PRF.
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  17. #17
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    I'd be interested to know how much difference there is between the standard euro and the euro-r. There isn't to much to tell them apart. But would one be utterly disappointed in the standard euro? Or disappointed in spending the extra coin to get the euro-r?

    Your thoughts please callers?

  18. #18
    8,000rpm (B Series Redline!) Reaper_2000's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sims
    I'd be interested to know how much difference there is between the standard euro and the euro-r. There isn't to much to tell them apart. But would one be utterly disappointed in the standard euro? Or disappointed in spending the extra coin to get the euro-r?

    Your thoughts please callers?
    I guess it depends on the purpose of the car

    my dad owns a cl9 euro accord, the k24a has bucketloads of torque!

    if you want a nice family laxxy car, the Euro is great!

    if you want a car to take to the track occasionaly, and love revving out ur vtec monster, well the k20a is obviously a better base to work from
    Quote Originally Posted by wagonman View Post
    did anyone see the guys nut hanging out his undies when he got down to show his spunk stain on the carpet

  19. #19
    4,000rpm (Taxi Drag) CL7R's Avatar
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    I am currently driving my self-imported CL7 Euro R (I import car as a hobby as my family friend runs a car export business in Japan).
    year 2003/9, done genuine 13320km on landing (now around 17000km). Basically brand new car really. Even still on its RE050 from new.
    I put in a 5-star alarm, re-tinted the car, changed some oils and a K&N air filter. MTF and RBF600 sitting in the garage. Hopefully will have my Mugen hose and 5zigen exhaust soon.
    Total price is around $33000 (and I was going to sell it...but getting more and more reluctant now )
    Absolutely lovely car. Lots of torque. and once you're above 5800 then it becomes a different character.
    The K20A has a balancer, and it's max torque comes out a little bit earlier than those of EP3/DC5 - all purposed for cruise rather than race.

    The problem with this car is:
    1. too heavy at 1390kg (if you compare it to EP3/DC5)
    2. gear ratio: the first 3 gears are the same with EP3/DC5, but 4th-6th are lower (for cruising again). I find it a bit annoying shifting between 3rd and 4th gear because of the larger gap.
    3. brake - yes as mentioned above. I know how to modify it but I hate LVV so well...
    4. it rides too high (you can put a fist, not fingers between the wheels and guard). But spring rate is actually quite firm for a sedan.
    5. hard to find aftermarket modification parts since nobody drives it here.

  20. #20
    7,000rpm (Peak Power) sirgav's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 2HEKTK
    Thats what I was after Eric :thumbsup:

    Whats the going rate landed for CL7's at the moment?
    1.4-1.7 million in japan,
    seen a silver 05 go for 1.45,
    Blue's and black seen to fetch close to 1.7 even when 03,
    red's and pearl white going for 1.5-1.6
    there a facelift in late 05 too... they go for bigger money.....
    Supporting a friendly NZhondas, ban "flaming. "

  21. #21
    3,000rpm (Grandma Drag)
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    My parents owned a nz new accord euro automatic and I got to drive it a fair bit. It wasn't quick and it handled ok. I myself now own a cl1 and find that the cl1 is quite noticeably quicker than the AT k24 and handles a lot better (can't compare stock cl1 as mine has got tein coilovers). No exhaust noise at all on the euro and the engine itself is pretty quite, I could never really tell when i-vtec hit unlike the cl1... But they do have nicer interiors, except the seats hurt my back when driving long distances (I would always choose the recaros on the cl1/7 over the factory seats). Exterior wise they also look very nice.

    Imo if I was to have some input ito the design of the cl7 euro r I would have wanted better brakes (cl1/cl7 essentially the same), ie the four pots of the dc5. Instead of using the k20a engine to use the k24a engine and tweak that engine (just to see what it could do and be different from the integras and civics), and lastly to make more of an visual impact - the bodykit is too subtle-you'd have to be pretty quick to spot a euro-r from a normal accord on the streets . At least the cl1 had flares, different taillights and a noticeable bodykit to set it apart from the other accords.

    I still want to own one though

    If you guys want to bother using google translator and then trying to understand him, this guys website has some very good info on both the cl1 and cl7 including factory power graphs and also a lot of modifications. Very good for owners of cl1 and cl7. Has a good graph comparing factory power and torque figures of the cl1 and cl7

    http://homepage2.nifty.com/yatti_/mycar.html

  22. #22
    4,000rpm (Taxi Drag) Graphite's Avatar
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    The CF4 SIR-T performs ok value for $ wise.

    heres a video of Torneo SIR-T vs Integra Type R, Civic Type R, Prelude Type S, S2000.. of course the Torneo isn't going to win.. however it seems to do ok. http://videos.streetfire.net/video/f...3677ee7d82.htm

    I bought a CF4 SIR-T due to getting it for the bargin price of $4500, so no big loan to pay off etc) the best thing is I own it.. If I had purchased a CL1 I'd have to spend 15k or so. then i'd be paying off a loan for 3 years.. so for me the CF4 was a good option.

    Of course I am saving up for a CL7, so in 2-3 years i'll buy one for cash.
    Daily: VW Golf GTX-Turbo DSG
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  23. #23
    8,000rpm (B Series Redline!) TakeiTeg's Avatar
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    Holy shit this is an old thread!

  24. #24
    4,000rpm (Taxi Drag) CL7R's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TakeiTeg
    Holy shit this is an old thread!
    It is too I just realise!

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