Engine build to take 10,000 revs on a b16a

[Rallygti]

I would like to pull 10 grand out of my b16a1

At the moment it has I/H/E and getting dyno tune and v-afc on monday.



I havent talked to any mechanics as of yet but i would like to get it to pull 10 grand, consistently.

I have thought about things a wee bit and for the while i would like to use the standard cams, possibly with adjustable gears.

Heres what i have on my list so far, Type R valves, valve retainers and valve springs, CTR pistons, Spoon head gasket, P&P of head.....

Any help would be much appreciated

[EG8T]

I suggest you investigate ALLMTR's setup. Incase you didnt know He's running a B18C which screams its way to 10,000 RPM+ & a 12.1 1/4 mile.

Maybe you could contact WorkshopX www.workshopx.com as they did alot of the work on ALLMTR & should be able to help you out.

[Xsi]

A Type R valvetrain would get you most the way to 9500, however there would be absolutely no point in revving that high with stock cams, you car wouldn't make much power past 7800 RPM
And with the high compression of the CTR pistons your engine would love some lumpier cams.
BTW, from all the people I have asked, the R retainers are the same as all B series.

[Rallygti]

Whats the best option for cams though


And how much $$$$$$

Also would i need some form of Ignition timing control?

Eg Apexi ITC?

[Disinfo]

Yeah with stock cams an increased rev-limit is a waste of time, for 10,000+rpm IO reckon you'd have to go fully aftermarket, ITR/CTR cams ain't designed to make power up that high.

[Matty]

Honda's ads say the Type R cams are designed to make power to 8750rpm. For 10,000rpm you'd probably have to go to the lumpiest Toda/JUN/Skunk2 cams.

ALLMTR's got some VTEC Killer cams, which eliminates the VTEC mechanism and runs the engine permanently in a "wild" state, meaning it can't idle to save itself. Read: No good for the street.

BTW, with I/H/E my EK VTiR's power curve is just starting to drop off (by about 1kW) at 8100rpm, from a peak at 7902rpm, so there's really not much more in the stock cams.

But then, do you want to rev that high just to say you can or is it for racing? Personally, I'd prefer to flesh out the range from 4000rpm up to about 8500-9000rpm as more down low should be more streetable.

[Xsi]

I'd go with a nice set of Skunk2 stage 2's 8)
Your VAFC should do an ok job of controlling the ECU department.

[NAspirated]

ur guna need a decent oil pump to manage this, not to mention cleaning up the block (and head). da last thing u want is the engine to give up wen its screaming that hard.

if u just wana show off then it would be a very expensive show.

[TuLaLiT]

Originally Posted by Matty

ALLMTR's got some VTEC Killer cams, which eliminates the VTEC mechanism and runs the engine permanently in a "wild" state, meaning it can't idle to save itself. Read: No good for the street.

thats not true , who said u cant use vtec killer on the street ???
i have a video i downloaded from honda-tech , B-series engine with vtec killer , it does have lumpy idle but the owner drive it on the street
it even has that toda quad throttle body setup

[David R]

Yeah you CAN use it on the street, but I think he ment it wasnt really practical for daily driving.
Do you want to go to 10k just so you can say "my car revs to 10000" or are you more concerned with power/times etc??

[ciacia]

Originally Posted by David R

Yeah you CAN use it on the street, but I think he ment it wasnt really practical for daily driving.
Do you want to go to 10k just so you can say "my car revs to 10000" or are you more concerned with power/times etc??

yeah well...
i would think driving a car with VTEC KILLER cams
is the same like driving any other cars with stock cams in it

the question is whether you would drive the car like that everyday
i wouldn't, coz the fule consumption of car using VTEC killer is just crazy
and no power on the bottom whatsoever..!!!

[Cyclone21]

Originally Posted by TuLaLiT

thats not true , who said u cant use vtec killer on the street ???
i have a video i downloaded from honda-tech , B-series engine with vtec killer , it does have lumpy idle but the owner drive it on the street
it even has that toda quad throttle body setup

Ronny I think Matty just worded his words in an incorrect fashion.. and I dont think Rallygti is after VTEC Killer cams. 8)

[Cyclone21]

Why 10,000rpm exactly? Form over fashion man..

[Blitza]

my 0.02c,
twin valve springs added to zaust, Kelford stage iii cams, 1.3mm shaved off the head, gizzmo chip, makes MEAN pwr 7.5k to 9.5k, 170.000 odd kays on the bog std bottom end, pulled it to bits and everything is all swt.

[Matty]

What I meant by "no good for the street" is that the car would be one grumpy little biatch when idling or trying to crawl in traffic, and you'd be best to have shares in an oil company. I guess it'd be like trying to drive a mid-90s BTCC Accord or something similar.

This is just what I've picked up from what the Yanks have said about them, but maybe they're just a bunch of soft-ankled pussies.

[Rallygti]

Im trying to decide which road to go down for times

High revving (expensive) engine build to make max power, the idea behind 10,000 was to avoid as many gear changed as pos and get it ripping and staying in the max power zone as much as possible... and the fact that these engines rev so well.


Other wise i could go down road of 2 front kevlar buckets etc no carpet, keep dash just radio and 2 front speakers, strip the rest, CF hood lexan glass, custom fibreglass rear hatch....

[TuLaLiT]

from ericksracing website , his car only making 265hp@wheels enough to get him 10s flat

265hp@wheels after i-dunno-how-much-he-spent-on-his-engine

on the other hand if u chuck a turbo , u dont need to rev to 10k to make power and less cheaper to make 265hp@wheels

but than again there is pros and cons between them , so make ur choice

[David R]

Who's running that set up Blitza?? What sorta times/power??

[Blitza]

erm, me, not yet measured, did 49 round centenial park on daggy tires and buggerall brakes.....
should be back in action in two weeks, as above + MAD spec headers, oil cooler, DVM flywheel and eXedy clutch/Pplate. Will do a 1/4 when I get a chance.

[BWDOWN]

I'm hella keen to see the Blitza CRX in 1/4 action seeing as it went very hard at track day

[TuLaLiT]

blitzisthemanayebro

[Kelsonmassif]

how much are you willing to spend?
no way will you make ne power on standard cams, it will have to be a full upgrade of your internals, valve train, pistons, cams and balancing out the bottom end. you would be running some high compression somewhere from 11:1 - 12:1

it would be daily drivable but it just would be a bitch to keep the revs up over the lumpy idle.

umm how much do spoon engines cost? dont they rev to 12000rpm?

[Rallygti]

Talking to mechanic tomorrow

Will post what he says

Race car dude...

[Gudgen]

265hp@wheels is flippn dam impressive. u say u want 10k rpm but how much of that would be useable? ie wheel spinning from 0 - 5k rpm?

im building a daily driven 9k rpm b16a. finish early next year.

have u notice some are goin the way of traction first? ppl pulling low 13's with 116kw@wheels. thats stock as.

[Coupe-R]

umm I am guess when building a lumy cam 10,000 rev b16a that there wouldn't be much wheel spin in the rev range of 0-5k as there would be no power till much over 6

unless u revved it up heaps and dropped the clutch
so wheel spin there would only be a problem if turbod, well b16a's i have driven wheel spin ain't too bad a prob below 5k