Thread: Help with first race

Go and do some track days and club events before you go jump in the deep end. NZ Timeattack you need a half cage minimum.
You need to learn how your car handles and how hard you can push it..... before you go following another far better setup car deep into a corner and end u end up crashing.
Believe me, it happens.

Originally Posted by fiasco

Honestly you're best to go to a reputable garage and get it set up. Hi Tech motorsport should be able to sort you out properly before hitting the track.
Give them a call and ask for Grady. Tell him Tristan recommended you.

+1 for Grady - serious talent!

Also you cant beat track time. Experience would make more difference then other mods. You could have the fastest Silvia in the world but if you have zero experience an experienced racer in a stock Silvia would probably be quicker .

Suspension settings can also depend on what sort of driver you are, and a number of other factors. You need to go and talk to a good garage like above, and tell them how the car feels for you at the moment (i.e. is it oversteering/understeering etc). Although, if you haven't already, a good base setup would definitely help. Get some seat time and learn your car before you jump into worrying about the fine tuning. It's not like Forza or Gran Turismo where there is one set setting for the car that is best.

Tyres depend on budget and limitations of the class you race in.

Keep an eye out for clubs like NZHondas and JTune running open days, and also consider joining your local car club and getting to some testing sessions.

I'm a relative newcommer to the motorsport scene. I only got into it at the start of the year and am loving it so far. My advice:

Start of doing track days and club sport events. Playday-on-track etc. Check out your local MSNZ affiliated car clubs. Join one. Do clubsport events, dual car sprints etc.

As far as suspension goes, basic setup would be something like: -3.0 degrees camber up front. -1.5 degrees camber at the back. If the car is street driven then half those values. Set a bit more positive caster than factory. Once you do a few track days and you see how your tyres are wearing then you can fine tune these settings. I use a crayon and draw across the edge of the tread and over onto the sidewall of the tyre, this way I can see how much of the tyre is getting used.

Set the damping on your BC golds about 1/2 way or 2/3 the way to hard, play around once you're at the track.

Most important thing is changing brake fluid. Brake fluid absorbs moisture, lowering the boiling point - old fluid is more likely to boil. Motul RBF600 is good stuff, you can get it form BNT.

Getting some racing brake pads is a good idea. check out Racebrakes (for Mintex and Ferodo pads) and Racetech (for Hawk pads)

I recommend starting of with good quality road tyres, not semi slicks. You will lean better car control and how to get the most out of your car. Its easier to slid without spinning out. I started with semi slicks and it was a bit of a mistake. I went back to road tyres for a few track days, and that helped me get to grips with the cars handling a lot. Once I went back to semis I knocked a couple of seconds off my lap times. Bridgestone RE11 or RE002 would be my choice. Once you use those up then get another set of wheels and some Toyo R888s

because semis are less forgiving when they do finally let go. You would also be travling faster on the semis meaning if you were to loose it the consequences would be greater.

Semis are pretty much on/off, where as street tires you can feel them starting to go which give you the chance to correct/drive out of it.

Racelign in Mt welly have done a fair few silvias. Al knows his stuff, would be a good starting point alignment wise.

Take it to a track day. Practice day not a racing day - less likely to learn anything worthy of mention at a race day, you'll be in the wrong frame of mind to absorb information if you're in competition mode IMO. Take it around the track as it is and learn where the car (and driver) need improvements. If you're going to change anything, fresh pads, fresh fluid, cooling system in good condition etc.

You haven't specified whether it's your first time on the track vs first actual race but seasoned practice day attendee so sorry if this all sounds basic. If it's your first time out, don't worry about suspension/chassis setup - you're unlikely to find the limits of any of that. I'd focus more on the maintenance/wear and tear stuff. Make sure the brakes are in good condition and will go the distance, make sure your engine is serviced and all fluids topped up/good condition, tyres all good, no annoying things like wobbly seat etc and familiarize yourself with the car and the track. You'll soon start to see where it needs improvement then you can ask for opinions on the various forums or visit the people mentioned earlier and have them assist with improving your setup to make it do what you want.

Just dialling in settings is a recipe for disaster IMO. You might find that the car doesn't suit you at all with generic settings and you spend your trackday fighting it/getting frustrated/not learning.

That's just what I think, almost certainly different to everyone else's opinion but to me having fun and learning as you go is more important than hoping to be competitive on your first day out - that's how people crash and ruin perfectly good cars.

Originally Posted by Horny_Devil

Semis are pretty much on/off, where as street tires you can feel them starting to go which give you the chance to correct/drive out of it.

lol no they're not. Unless you've got a funny setup semis aren't on or off. You'll find that they have a very progressive let go, not a snap - full race slicks can snap on you, there is a big difference, trust me.

Wordnz is on the right track with his advice though. Semis aren't for everyone, if you've never experienced a car on its limit or sliding around then good road tyres will give you a better indication of where that limit is and how to stay on the edge of it - then step up to Semis and bang, you're going alot faster .

Just as I was saying before, its all about track time. You can spend your life on the internet researching this and that and listening to some guys opinion on the otherside of the world or another guy down the road that has done 2 track days in his road car but if you dont get out there and experience it yourself then you wont be going anywhere. Trust me, after your first couple of goes it will soon become apparent where you need to make changes. Mixing with the right people at the track can be a big help to get 'real world experience' (I hear its all the rage these days) from experienced racers (not the ones mentioned above). Heck there is a good chance a 12 year old in a Mini might be faster then you but just simply following his racing lines and then hearing what tyres he runs might be all the help you need to get a competetive edge.

Get amongst it and join a real motorsport NZ car club. Once you get out there and start having fun you'll be surpirsed how quickly the pace will come .

Originally Posted by tysonzane

lol no they're not. Unless you've got a funny setup semis aren't on or off. You'll find that they have a very progressive let go, not a snap - full race slicks can snap on you, there is a big difference, trust me..

Not what i have found but hey everyone is different. i found compared to my road tires they were a lot more on/off.

My experience is that semis are more on/off than slicks. Does depend on the tyre. Yokohama A048s are more progressive than R888s in my opinion - but that is because sidewall construction for example, is different. In my humble opinion, semis go off quicker than slicks because they can overheat much more quickly because it has a semi tread and the rubber moves round more than it does on slicks. Road tyres go even quicker, because the rubber heats up rapidly as it moves around more on the carcas. When we race, you get gripped up quicker with semis because o this, and they then go off quicker - say lap six or seven of an eight lapper. Slicks take a little longer to come in but just get better and better over a similar eight lap race. Road tyres woould probably grip for a lap or two then start squirming. Having said all of that it shouldn't matter at this early stage which tyres you use, part of the skill is learning how to make them work. Follow this advice from earlier in the thread and you won't go far wrong:

I'm a relative newcommer to the motorsport scene. I only got into it at the start of the year and am loving it so far. My advice:

Start of doing track days and club sport events. Playday-on-track etc. Check out your local MSNZ affiliated car clubs. Join one. Do clubsport events, dual car sprints etc.

As far as suspension goes, basic setup would be something like: -3.0 degrees camber up front. -1.5 degrees camber at the back. If the car is street driven then half those values. Set a bit more positive caster than factory. Once you do a few track days and you see how your tyres are wearing then you can fine tune these settings. I use a crayon and draw across the edge of the tread and over onto the sidewall of the tyre, this way I can see how much of the tyre is getting used.

Set the damping on your BC golds about 1/2 way or 2/3 the way to hard, play around once you're at the track.

Most important thing is changing brake fluid. Brake fluid absorbs moisture, lowering the boiling point - old fluid is more likely to boil. Motul RBF600 is good stuff, you can get it form BNT.

Getting some racing brake pads is a good idea. check out Racebrakes (for Mintex and Ferodo pads) and Racetech (for Hawk pads)

I recommend starting of with good quality road tyres, not semi slicks. You will lean better car control and how to get the most out of your car. Its easier to slid without spinning out. I started with semi slicks and it was a bit of a mistake. I went back to road tyres for a few track days, and that helped me get to grips with the cars handling a lot. Once I went back to semis I knocked a couple of seconds off my lap times. Bridgestone RE11 or RE002 would be my choice. Once you use those up then get another set of wheels and some Toyo R888s